If you had to describe the ideal hero, a good man, a guy you'd want your child to bring home to meet you, what characteristics would he have?We're starting our section on the male and/or trickster figure in fairy tales in the fairy tale class I teach at IUSB. But it seems that the fairy-tale male is a trickster, a noodlehead, a dispossessed loser, a creepy father or a cookie cutter Prince Charming.
How come?
How should he be?
What makes a man?
What makes him a character with character?
48 comments:
The hero needs to be flawed. A good character has a million characteristics and they can't all fall under one ideal. To make the hero believable the hero has to be so much more than just handsome and clever. He can't just ride up on his white horse, rescue the girl and ride off into the sunset. It's boring, and though the stories are usually unrealistic, the readers still want to be able to relate with the characters. No one is perfect so the characters can't be either. It's not fair. So the hero could have a sick sense of humor, he could show up nearly too late, he could be downright mean. Perhaps the hero isn't a people person, or he isn't really too attractive. The point is the hero should be like everyone else, just unlike everyone else. He must be us, but better.
Yes, it reminds me of the version of Beauty and the Beast when Beauty feels disappointed when she loses her beast to the handsome hero. My hero would be noble of character and have humility. The strength to bear all misfortunes and endure and good humour and a plucky spirit to make him an entertaining companion.
I'm a fan of Fearnot, or the boy who left home to learn about the shivers, or whatever variation you find him under. He's not the classic Beowulfian hero, perhaps flawed but for the most part big and brassy and daring... instead he's brave, curious, and when it gets right down to it, what ends up scaring him is the thought of losing someone he loves.
Why would the role of the male in fairy tales adopt trickster “ish” characteristics?
I’ve been reading Boyd’s “On the Origin of Stories” which views fairy tales via the evolutionary psychology paradigm. While Boyd doesn’t speak of the “trickster” archetype directly (lesson one in psychology: evolutionary doesn’t talk to psychoanalytic, so directly acknowledging Jung would be quite the no-no) he does discuss the “cheater” or “freeloader” strategies and their social, or survival enhancing consequences within our species.
First, there have been many anthropological and psychological studies demonstrating that the adoption of “altruism and cooperation” among social groups is a fantastic survival mechanism. What if we all expected to stab one another in the back? What could we accomplish as a group without constantly collapsing into time and energy consuming warring? Not as much evidently as we are able to help one another, and in turn anticipate others reciprocating in turn.
Some fairy tales, i.e. “Bluebeard” demonstrate the social consequences of fooling young women and society at large to violate the standing social norms about murder. In turn an eye for an eye occurs, bluebeard is cut into pieces, tricked by the “foolish young woman” and brought to his terrible trickster end. The trickster in this tale is very well teaching human beings about cooperation (between the foolish young woman and her sisters, brothers, the old woman etc) “executing” the consequences of violation social altruism. Cheaters never prosper!
Qualities of the ideal prince charming or hero would be he has to respect myself and my family. He has to be nice, smart, positive, stable, independent, strong, confident, willing to be himself, and willing to help others. Also, he has to like children and dogs!
I love working with children and of course I have to add dogs because my boyfriend and I have a Dalmatian which we love and treat like a child. These are the qualities that would stand out to me as a true prince charming.
Many of the princes that I have read in my Fairy Tales class are truly “fake”. As what Professor Worford commented, many of these men are what you call cookie cutter or dim-witted characters, which I cannot stand. I want a type of man that is his own person, strong, and independent. Not some phony that thinks he knows it all. The qualities that I wrote at the top should be this type of man we should read more often. Not the other fellows in the fairy tales stories we read now. They are boring and unrealistic.
Ashley G.
Ironically, I see the Western God as a trickster figure: the one of the Bible, Torah, and Quran. He has promised three different peoples the same holy site, but never interferes to specify his proper contingents in this disorientation. He shrouds himself in the most enigmatic particulars and expects his creations to adore and worship him with a most equivocal faith. The biggest trick of all lies in the fact that he is omniscient and omnipotent: He created man knowing fully that he was flawed and that he would turn out to be flawed, but He perpetually punished him for his “blasphemy” and sin. And on a similar note, He “gives life” as “free will” to us and takes life away, and He is the ultimate judiciary of our character, exalting our soul to eternal pleasure or condemning it to infinite perdition: but again, ironic to the essence of this idea, He gives life and “free will” to the individuals of whom he already contains the knowledge of all of their decisions and behaviors of character before they are born—ultimately condemning those who have acted against His tenets. If He knows before they are born that He will condemn them to an eternity of suffering, why allow them life in the first place? Eighty or so years of corporeal life doesn’t seem worth an eternity of cruel torment. God is a juggernautish trickster figure who seems to contradict his own rules.
Josh B.
Unfortunately the point of a perfect prince or Ideal Hero has changed a lot in last few years. Ideal hero before would be someone who treats everyone equal and makes his heroine happy in every aspect of her life, someone who she can confide into and feel safe around. Well, that is not true today. Many people are not even interested into safety. Many “heroes” are the biggest weirdo’s out there that treat everyone with no respect.
So what do we are looking for in a hero today? I have no idea. Out of my own experience that what hero was few years ago is not in any more. We are seeing these relationships which are on the first look falling apart, but our “heroine” is madly in love with that person who just treats her like a property or in most cases like someone would treat a dog.
What is a “Hero?” I have no idea. You tell me.
I think that fairy tales take a real life personality and transform that dynamic concept into a static characters so that we can see the flaws within that characteristic that the author is magnifying. For example you have Bluebeard who is possibly a combination or real life villians and he is then made into this super villian of a sort in order to emphasize the theatrical aspects of the horrific crimes he is a model for. I was reading this last night and thinking about how I would react to a character like Bluebeard and while I was horrified by his crimes I was even more annoyed that the wife tried to put what she had found out OUT OF HER MIND. Yeah she must have been out of her mind because there is no way I would have waited for my psychotic wife murdering husband to return even if I did have guests to keep up appearances for. How unrealistic is that the brothers get there just in time to stop Bluebeard from killing their sister too? Come on! Rant concluded :)
-B.H.
How come the fairy-tail male is a “cookie cutter” prince charming?
A lot has been done on feminism in fairy tales, and how the treatment of women or the creation of the princess is in some ways a means to reduce women to powerless figures in patriarchal society. Very (VERY) few would disagree that gender roles are forceful shapers of personalities, dependent upon the norms of the society in which these individuals are nested.
Though many have come to the defense of women, fewer have come to consider how the power of our males has been reduced or diluted to an unhealthy degree. I remember watching an Oprah episode in which a domestic violence expert was being interviewed. She asked why we thought men in our society tended to be so controlling over their wives/girlfriends, then posed a suggestion that blew me away. She pointed out that men are so shut down emotionally by our societal norms, that there is no place to express hurt without being socially castrated. Some men then rely on their partners to be their only source of outlet for expressing these emotions. Hence the controlling behavior. (Not that I’m saying domestic violence is EVER ok btw)
Anyway, how can a man have depth, or be anything other than cookie cutterish if the only role we’re comfortable assigning him (as a societal group) is one of stoic provider.
Melissa L.
The ideal hero would really just be someone that could make my daughter happy, or in my case would make me happy. He would not have to rescue me from anything or pick me up on a white horse for our dates, but he most certainly should have a desire to talk our problems through even if some arguing was involved. He should also be handsome...to me. Beauty truly is in the eye of the beholder so if he is handsome to me he may not be to someone else, just like someone elses prince charming may not be handsome to me. He should be understanding and never be afraid to state his true feelings no matter what they may be. For sure not a trickter exactly, but he can be a little goofy if he likes.
Julia C.
If I could describe my ideal hero, he would have to be handsome, smart, independent, stable, strong, positive, confident, and have a sense of humor. If you haven't noticed, most trickster figures in fairy tales are ideally a cookie-cutter Prince Charming as Kate said. I think that an ideal hero should be normal. They shouldn't be perfect, but have flaws just like everyone else in this world. No one is perfect so why should we dream of a Prince Charming like we see on tv or in fairy tales? I want a man with the characteristics I stated above, but I don't expect him to be perfect. I don't expect that he would convey all those characteristics. I just want a plain old Joe. Someone that everyone could relate to. A guy like Patrick Dempsey in the movie Enchanted. Patrick Dempsey plays a normal guy. He is handsome, independent, stable, and confident. He portrays many of the characteristics I listed. He works for a living and lives in an apartment with his young daughter. His wife or girlfriend left him so he takes care of his daughter. He meets the "Princess" and falls in love with her while he is dating someone else. That might sound bad, but if you watched the movie you would understand. Everything in his life is normal. Anyone can relate!
Whitney M.
In my personal opinion an ideal hero do not exist in reality. In this society an ideal hero for any parents would be a man who graduated from a top University, and have a good job etc. Hence he will make his future wife “happy”. The idea of an ideal hero is social constructed-- today heroes are different from centuries ago. And also, an Ideal hero will be different in other societies in the world. An ideal hero from an American family will be different from an Asian family. Ideal hero exists only in fairy tales. People change their mind frequently. If a person believes that her or his ideal hero is someone who loves her or him and respected him and also provides money that will probably work for them. However, if that person stops providing money or love, the ideal hero will not longer exist.
Ever A.
An ideal hero is a man who doesn’t think he is perfect and is not the most handsome and charming man you will ever meet. He is the guy who admits his flaws and yet doesn’t let them be an excuse to fail and not even try. He is guy who is kind, trusting, and who will do anything to help. Even if it means going out in the middle of the night to buy you some tampons or taking care of the cooking and cleaning when your worked overtime. A man is a man when he is willing to help out around the house and with the kids not just sit down drinking beer and watching t.v. with his buddies. He doesn’t think the wife is his personal servant and is that she is not allowed to contradict him. He can make mistakes and forget to pay the rent because he bought a guitar hero instead but then makes it up taking you out to dinner increasing your debt. An ideal hero is just a guy who isn’t afraid to make mistakes who isn’t afraid to admit he’s scared when things get tough.
Angie D.
The Ideal Hero. Let's define hero in the context in which we speak...shall we. According to Oxford, a hero is "A man who exhibits extraordinary bravery, firmness, fortitude, or greatness of soul, in any course of action, or in connexion with any pursuit, work, or enterprise; a man admired and venerated for his achievements and noble qualities" (link at bottom). I am going to take five words from this definition and define them hyperbolically. In any course of action, it states. Due to the fact that I am a male and I grew up with 3 older sisters, I always had the opportunity to hear my sister’s complaints about men. I have learned a thing or two about our downfalls and I know the tricks and words that are not said by women. I do not claim to understand women, but I have yet to die of a heart attack due to shock when I have my moments. With that said, the "Ideal Hero" plays numerous roles.
He, in modern times, learns recipes on his own before he meets his life partner so that he is prepared to cook dinner for that person when they get off work late. He learns to sew in the 7th grade and practices sewing his own patches into his torn pants because his lady has other things to do than to serve him. He learns how to manage his own money so that when the desire comes for that specific yellow leather wallet that just went on sale is available then he is absolutely willing to buy it for her. The Ideal Hero stands his ground and yet is willing to build upon it. The Ideal Hero goes out of his way to wash the dishes because, in reality, it only takes 5 minutes.
There is a price, however, in the actions of the Ideal Hero. Reciprocity is the game here, and if each partner is not able to reciprocate actions, then there is no Ideal Hero. A relationship is not "50/50" because if you are only giving 50% toward the relationship, then you are not giving it your all. A relationship is 100/100, not 75/100 or 100/50. Altruistic relationships don’t last longer than the honeymoon period.
There is no perfect man and there is no perfect woman. We live to understand ourselves and progress with an open mind about our flaws. The Ideal Hero is never as ideal as he should be until he dies. In this sense, he has played the game of life and came to the end of it being able to achieve all that was possible for him.
Oxford English Dictionary definition of Hero # 3.
http://dictionary.oed.com/cgi/entry/50105289?query_type=word&queryword=hero&first=1&max_to_show=10&sort_type=alpha&result_place=1&search_id=Hjyy-dUdlaj-8978&hilite=50105289
The idea guy! Wow what a question. I chuckle at the fact that the guy in fairy tales is to be considered the “cookie cutter” guy. First of all, most of the fairy tales I have been reading lately the male is barely mentioned, and if he is, no one I’d be going after. First and foremost is respect. I want a guy to respect me for exactly who I am, as well as my family. There couldn’t a worst trait than someone who judges people and looks down upon them. I’m hoping to find a guy to equally out my balances, as well as, enhance some of the ones that are already there. Personality is another HUGE trait to take into account. It can by far out shine looks. Now don’t get me wrong, I do think everyone on some sort of level has that “shallowness” to them in the fact that the person that we date we have to remotely judge on outward appearance and find somewhat attractive. I am arguing that a great personality can make that “sort of cute guy” tremendously shine through. A person that you constantly want to be around, that isn’t draining. For me, ideally, he also needs to have a great level of intelligence. I really find that attractive in a person; someone who wants to get bettering themselves, and expanding their mind. Everyone’s view of what is ideal is always going to be different. For the sake of this not being a wanted ad for dating, I will be cutting myself off because I feel like if I really were to be able to sit down and state the “ideal” man, I could be sitting here typing for hours. That’s why I’ll just be looking for Mr. Semi-ideal :).
Colleen B.
What is the 'male ideal'? I haven't a clue; the female half of our species is largely an enigma to me. I do, however, know how I attempt to live my daily life -- though I'm not sure it makes me heroic in the least.
Like others, I believe the ideal man has to be flawed (perfection is boring) -- but more than that, the bit of his character that makes him unique, is that he has to recognize his flaws.
This, I believe, is the aspect of his character that is most essential: the willingness to be self-critical (or, at the very least, self-aware).
Look at Beast, for example. He knows he has many admirable qualities -- kindness, intelligence, etc -- and yet he is, well... a beast. He's fully aware that his unseemly physical appearance is unlikely to procure him love, though it does little to prevent him from maintaining a steady, honest realization of his own self-worth as a man.
If a man can do this for himself, he can surely recognize admirable, worthwhile qualities in others -- even if he or she may not meet the perceived cultural ideal, whatever that is.
I do not believe that anyone can create a ‘perfect’ man. For one thing, there’s no way there could be such a thing ;p (Had to sneak that in there). But seriously, who would even want the ideal man? You may think it would make your life better to have to perfect prince show up at your door, but in reality how long would you be able to deal with him? Everyone has their own idea of good characteristics and what they look for in a partner. While I may see the strong belief in ones values as a good characteristic, someone else might see that as being someone too overbearing. The perfect prince really does place a tough ideal on young men. You can’t expect anyone to be perfect, let alone fit everyone’s ideal of perfect. I think this may be the reason that the ‘hero’ character is never described in detail as far as personality goes. It leaves the description up to the reader so that you can place your own ideals into the role.
Christina R
An ideal hero is really all in the eye of the beholder. What I think makes someone that special may not be what someone else thinks. At times people judge each other’s “hero” or significant other through their own eyes when the only eyes that matter is the one who’s “hero” it is. Not everyone is looking for the same qualities. Just as Ashley stated what traits hers would need as, “He has to be nice, smart, positive, stable, independent, strong, confident, willing to be himself, and willing to help others. Also, he has to like children and dogs!” To her these are important to her but who is to say who is smart, who is to say someone is nice. Not all people see these things the same way. All I’m saying is that it really comes down to each individual and what they look for and we need to quit judging when we are looking from the outside.
John J
A hero or a tricker usually have skills that make it possible for them to accomplish a task of some sort. It doesn't necessarily make them the good guy though. I do believe a hero is some with virtues so I guess that would distingiush between him and the trickster. A hero is easier to support in a moral sense but the tricker, like in Jack and the Beanstalk, can sometimes trick us into backing him up in the sam way. It isn't until we analyze his motives and ways of accomlishing things that we begin to question if what he is doing is right. The distinction between versions of Jack and the Beanstalk make it hard to know whether you should support Jack or not depending on whether or not he is stealing back his fathers possessions and avenging his death or just taking things of value because he is a greedy trickster. Also after discussing this tale in class it helps to make connections to Jack and the British colonizing and then seeing the Ogre as the 'uncivilized' people. That at least helps put in in perspective and switch the auto support I sort of always had for Jack when I read this tale growing up.
B.H.
While I think it is impossible to describe the perfect man, like one reviewer said he would get boring, I think that there are qualities in a man that makes him a good candidate for a husband and for a father. The most important quality is respect. He must respect me the same way that I will respect him. That’s just the way it is. If you don’t start out with that foundation it will be an unhappy marriage on both sides. There’s more to it than just respect as well. There’s loyalty. That does not mean that he will never look at another woman just the same as it means I will never look at another man but it does mean that he will back me on something that I believe in and that he won’t leave when things get tough. I would do the same for him. I think that the “perfect” man is probably someone that is full of little imperfections. That is what makes him human. He’s a guy, he’s going to leave the toilet seat up and he’s probably going to leave his dirty socks on the floor but as long as he loves, respects, and is loyal to me, do the imperfections really matter in the long run?
I'm tempted to just quote Rita from Groundhog Day. And it would work, because Bill Murray is absolutely the ideal male character - in, or out, of the movies.
But being someone who doesn't really spend a lot of time dwelling on "the ideal male", this question required some thought. And as someone who doesn't spend a lot of time thinking, (it's a filthy habit, thinking) it was a challenge.
I've never enjoyed the 'Disney perfect' character. It's boring to see the dude on a white horse, knocking the villains aside with his perfect jaw as he flips his flowing hair over his shoulder.
But then again, I see that character every time I look in the mirror - so perhaps it's modesty that's holding me back, I always tell people I'm the most modest person in the world, (it's true, especially given how amazing I am) so I suppose it would feel too narcissistic if I enjoyed Disney's vision of perfection.
Neither do I enjoy the angst-ridden self-loathing perfect characters that seem to be becoming ever more popular.
While I am impressed to see them single-handedly supporting the entire male-mascara industry, I find them annoying on every other conceivable level. I hate myself for feeling that way though, it makes me want to slit my wrists.
I suppose I don't have a single idea character, male or female. There are so many traits I enjoy that are mutually exclusive that I couldn't have just one. I enjoy looking though.
I wanted to make another post about tricksters. I love trickster characters. Not so much the cruel ones, like Jack, but the truly clever ones.
But since the trickster character deals in deception, what separates the 'good' ones from the 'bad' ones? I think an excellent example comes in the form of one of my favorite tricksters, Alexandre Dumas' Edmond Dantes - better known as "The Count of Monte Cristo". Throughout the story, he's intentionally destroying people's entire lives, not only their wealth, power, and reputations, but literally driving some of them to their deaths. So why are we rooting for him? Because they deserved it. Without going into all the details, they ruined his life, had him falsely imprisoned, and left him to rot in the worst possible conditions. Who wouldn't want to see him get his revenge?
So that's the basic reason to root for a trickster, when the other person deserves to be tricked.
Of course, it doesn't always have to be that extreme, it could just be the stuck-up character tricked into a dunking tank, or something along those lines - the underlying concept is the same.
Of course, we almost always hate the trickster when he's unrepentantly manipulating a 'good' character. But what about the gray area in between?
I think Mark Twain's Tom Sawyer is an excellent example of that. Twain was a master of the trickster character, and to read anything about his life, one can only imagine it came naturally to him. But Tom Sawyer tricks other kids into paying him to let them do his work - that doesn't seem very nice.
But there's really no harm done. Sawyer, like the great showman
P. T. Barnum, is a master of "humbug". Sure, he may be fleecing you blind, but he's making you love it. People root for Tom for the same reason they laughed at Barnum's "This way to the egress!". It's clever, it's fun, and nobody gets hurt.
Anyway, there are just way too many trickster characters and subtle subtypes to get into them here, but I'm really looking forward to this next paper. I think it's going to be a lot of fun.
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It is interesting to think about the male figure in a fairy tale. I have always pictured the handsome prince charming but I never thought beyond his looks. I haven’t thought until now about what he is like once the story ends and the couple lives happily ever after. The appearance of the prince charming seems to be everything a girl can imagine. As always I soon discover what lies beyond my childhood images and thoughts of fairy tales that mostly Disney has imposed on me. I am beginning to see just how big of tricksters the male character can be. We all know that no one is perfect so therefore even in fairy tales I tend to think that the male figure, even the prince charming, can't be perfect. Every man is going to have his flaws, whether or not we as women accept them depends on us and how much we are willing to bare. I think the reason that male figures in fairy tales are not perfect is because, well let's face it; there would not be a good story without some trickster behavior. Fairy tales would be boring without a noodle head or dispossessed loser to move the story move along. But as far as me being a mother one day, I would not want my daughter bringing home a trickster kind of character. I think a good man should possess honesty, trust, and kindness. He should be able to take care of his woman through caring acts of kindness. I believe there is a prince charming out there for every girl because each one of us has different opinions of what a good man should be. The trickster male figure is tricky to figure out.
Katelyn L.
Listing qualities that make a good hero can be fairly subjective. Some people look for one thing, others look for another. If we try to get beyond subjective thoughts we may be able to get to the heart of what a hero truly is. All superficial trappings aside, a hero is one thing: selfless. A hero puts the needs of others above his own needs. We exalt heroes because of this very fact. They do what most people don’t, or won’t, do because human nature leans, for the most part, toward selfishness. We usually look out for our own good first. But when the rare person comes along who is able to set aside their own wants and desires in order to care for someone else, a hero is born.
Because of this, a hero can come in any shape and size. It really has nothing to do with external features and has everything to do with internal fortitude. It does not depend on economic status, educational status, or even social status. It depends on moral fiber. British politician and author Benjamin Disraeli said, “The legacy of heroes is the memory of a great name and the inheritance of a great example.” And a great example they are indeed. Anyone can be mediocre. It takes a special depth of character to rise above the expected human nature. Those who dare to seek a deeper meaning to life than purely self gratification, achieve what few ever have: the status of hero.
We talked about the trickster the other day in class and then I saw a terrible news report. A woman was woke up at two in the morning by what she thought was a police officer but when she opened the door a man who was not a police officer came in and raped her. This just made me think of a real life trickster and this is trickery at its worse. He knew she would open the door if he posed himself as a police man because most of us trust the police and would not expect anything like this to happen. Because of this the news reporter said that police were advising people to call 911 before you let a “policeman” into your house to make sure they are legitimate. How sad is it that we have come to this? Tricksters in our fairy tales do not always hurt others with their trickery but in this case someone was very badly hurt. I agree with Nathan that I sometimes root for the trickster but only in the cases when harm is not done.
Girard’s mimetic rivalry and fairy tales
Rene Girard argues that violence originates from desire, in this case two warring parties who desire the same thing. One party observes another’s desire for an object, and mimics the desire. If the object desired is of limited supply, violence ensues. This can occur between individuals and societies, and even in non-human species according to Girard. Parties or individuals can then perpetuate violence by mimicking one another’s violent behavior.
Once violence has escalated to this degree, something must be done to stop it. In steps the scapegoat, with one requirement. He or She must have nothing to do with the object of desire. This helps the warring parties overlook the cognitive dissonance created by simultaneously wanting to maintain violence engagement (to win so to speak) and fearing its continuance. Over time, this figure can become venerated as a martyr, or someone innocent who accepts guilt often in order to preserve the greater good. Girard asserts that the theory is alive in many of our creation myths, take for example Abrahimic traditions(See post above for trickster figure in this tradition).
In what ways might the theory reveal itself in fairy tales? Jack and the bean stalk? Blue beard? Hansel and Gretel? It seems true to me that a common plot demonstrates the origin of desire as creating tension or excitement in a plot, and is often the root of violence within a script. Was the Jack’s giant an evil ogre or a scapegoat not yet cycling to veneration? Maybe useful maybe not….
Melissa L.
I have many characteristics that describe my ideal hero (or just ‘good guy or gal’).
#1: He (or she) must be incredibly considerate, not just towards me, but he must consider how other people with differing backgrounds, cultures, and opinions would feel in a situation. Then he must recognize this and be accordingly decent.
#2: He must be able to make the difficult decisions that are painful, yet necessary for success.
#3: I will know he is good because of his kindness to waiters and animals. (I feel like people who are not polite to those who serve them are not really good people).
#4: He must not take unfair advantage of others in order to get ahead.
#5: The ideal hero must be honorable.
#6: This person must not be egotistical.
#7: A ridiculous sense of humor also always helps.
#8: Finally, this person must be able to realize that it is as much the little things as it is the grand victories that makes one a hero. After all, while there is so much terrible stuff in the world, people do good things every day.
Heroes come in all personality types but which personality fits an ideal hero? Many of the men in society today are not as concerned with finding a young maiden to save and commit to. Men today want to have multiple women, none of who he is distressing over. Even though these kind of men are completely self-involved, some women still swoon over them. Take the main-stream rap artists, a lot of their lyrics constantly disrespect and degrade women. Despite the harsh and vulgar lyrics women still dance to the songs and commend the artist. Not all rap is this way but a very large chunk of it is. There are also those men who have such low self esteem that they take on a significant other just to have a meaning in life. This type tends to be clingy and jealous which some women mistake for caring attribute but only shows that they are not thinking about their girlfriends best interest at all (which is love) but about their own welfare. Either way the ideal hero is only a hero unto himslef in this day and age.
Sherry B.
In my opinion, the ideal hero or guy my parents would like me to bring home would be someone that is well educated, caring, and has goals of helping others.
I think the male roles in fairy tales are the way they are because it is more realistic. I believe there are more guys that are tricksters than heroes. At least guys my age, they seem to care more about theirselves than being a hero and helping other people.
The male roles should be more like heroes. Maybe caring for a sick elderly couple or helping someone be positive as they are going through treatments for cancer.
I think what make a man is their heart. I don’t think a guy becomes a man till his heart is full of love for other people and wanting to make others happy. A man cares about others, like a dad. To be a great dad that a child would remember in a positive way, he would have to care more about his family than himself.
What makes him a character with a character is his characteristics. A guy plays a role as a character in a book and is his one character due to his own personal characteristics.
The generic prince charming is some kind of royalty/important person who didn't really do anything except be born to attain his status. He is "beautiful" and "rich." I think he is like this because that is what everyone aspires for, even if they won't admit it. Even way back when these stories were written people wanted what we want today; people want to be beautiful and rich and important.
In my opinion, the fairy tale male should be someone who is worthy. He should be a person who has done admirable things; he should be hard working; he should be attractive. He should be good with kids and good with the family. He should have some sort of job or means of supporting a family. I think an every day guy would do the trick instead of having them live up to the expectations of a prince.
Heather V.
An ideal hero is hard to describe. In America we want what we don’t have. We want what we can’t have. My ideal hero for a male character is one that loves unconditionally. I know that may seem strange but I feel like the men around me do not have this quality. Because it is something the men around me lack I favor it more than other qualities they do have that I take for granted. Another quality that is important to me is ambition. Men need to have goals in their lives. They need to have a sense of where they are and must always be bettering themselves. Unfortunately the men around me have no goals and have no ambition in life. My brother is a teenager and if my mother would let him (and she generally does) he would sit on his XBOX and play until he falls asleep in his recliner. My boyfriend in the dame in many regards. I lose him hours at a time to the video system of his choosing at that particular moment.
It is curious to me how we live in 2010 and can still manage as women to go along with the theme of this topic without wondering why we are not being asked to put a woman in the place of rescuing herself. We have fairy tales from all different side of the globe, from “Little Red Riding Hood” all the way to “Aladdin”. Is anyone else wondering where the female hero's are? Look, I understand that historically women have not have a voice, I also get that this was not the question that was given as a topic. I am just trying to call attention to the fact that maybe it should have been. Maybe if “Snow White” had a brain and a backbone she would not have ended up having twins and not even remembering having sex with her prince charming. Listening to repeated warnings not to open the door because her step-mom was trying to kill her for some odd reason was not enough to stop her. All I can say is she lacked cleverness for certain.
Why are we looking to create male hero’s that are clever, strong, and handsome? Are we trying to delude ourselves from the truth? I mean, let’s face it, today women are the ones bringing home the bacon, frying it, than after putting the kids to bed tackling laundry and homework as well. I am not saying that there are no good men in the world or anything like that. I am just saying that as long as we are making up a super hero, let’s make it a real good one. Let’s give this mom super abilities that would make mom’s everywhere say “I have always wanted to be able to do that”. Let’s go a step further and give her the ability to maintain her life without a man to guide her. One of the comments was for a man to love unconditionally. We must love ourselves unconditionally first before ever preparing to ask that of someone else. How is he going to love you unconditionally when we do not even love ourselves in this way? Give her cleverness, strength of character, and the ability to be totally content with life, independently. Let the movement to equality for women take another step forward with a female hero who gets the job done without the help of a man, just like so many women today.
The ideal guy that my parents would want me bring home is a guy that is strong both mind & heart, loving, intelligent, protector, good with kids, well liked, honest, trustworthy, & considerate. Who wouldn’t want this I sure do and everyone should get this but like KateW says it doesn’t happen that way in these fairy tales. Why, well that's how the authors have made them out to be, maybe because they had fathers or lovers that were creepy, scary, or tricksters. Who knows the true reasons? A real man is a person who would sacrifice anything for their loved ones, do anything to make their wrong rights, and care and devote their life’s to that one person. Why fairy tales do this, I'm not sure but men shouldn’t be that way, but unfortunately we have some of those in our life’s.
KM
An ideal hero must have a mixture of numerous demanding qualities. First, strong moral values must form the base of his character. Empathizing with others and conducting himself in a manner that takes the implications of his actions into account is paramount. Secondly, he must have the strength and courage to do what he knows is right and to adhere to his own values. If he cannot do this, then having values in the first place does not matter. Subsequently, intelligence, maturity, and wisdom are necessary for him to understand the value of life, to have higher goals to drive him on his life’s quest, and to have the skill to achieve his goals.
Some optional characteristics could add icing to the cake. An accurate sense of humor shows that he understands the difference between the trivial and the important (what to poke fun at and when to act seriously). Good looks and a strong body would make the character appealing, but I rank these as secondary in importance. Despite his appearances or physical strength, the hero must have the good inner qualities, or else he is an empty shell of a character.
(These qualities could apply to a female character as well)
T390 Andrew S.
My ideal hero would be honest, trustworthy, protective but not overbearing, confident but also humble, independent, intelligent, reliable, polite, and respectful. He has to be able to make me laugh. I love a guy that has a good sense of humor. Of course, I must also find him good-looking. He does not have to be the most handsome and muscular person in the world and not everyone has to find him attractive. The only thing that matters is whether I think so. I also do not think the ideal hero should be perfect; he must have flaws. Flaws are what make a person unique. I would not want a man that seemed faultless and too good to be true. He also does not have to be rich. As long as he is able to support himself enough to survive, that is perfectly fine with me. Overall, an average man is ideal for me, not the cookie-cutter prince charming.
Tara K. T390
If i had to describe the ideal hero he would have the characteristics of my father. My father has worked hard every single day of his life to provide for his family, and give his wife and kids everything they deserved. He's caring and loyal. And loyalty is such an underrated quality in people these days, but it is a quality my father instilled in me as a child. The ideal hero, like my father, would be down to earth. Confident but never conceited. Strong but never violent. The ideal hero, takes care of his responsibilities, without complaining, and not because he has to but because he wants to. I also think the ideal hero should show goodwill to others, even those that he does not know. Anyone can be nice to there friends and family, but it takes a real man to go out of there way to be nice to someone they do not know. Also, in the ideal hero, you want someone who has been tested in there life. Not some one who's had it easy there whole life. You want someone who's been tested and passed, someone who's shown what they're really made of.
An ideal hero would have to be respectful most important to himself and my family, but someone that would make my daughter happy. The ideal hero for my daughter would have the characteristics of my dad. My dad has all the characteristics of a hero, he work hard for what he wants, he is funny, confident, independent, loyal, hones, respectful, etc. My dad is the type of person that has never complained about anything, has had his ups and downs. Not like in fairy tales where the ideal hero is fake and life is planned out for him, they don’t have to worry about anything. My dad started from the bottom when he got here to Goshen and his motivation in life has been his family providing for us in anyways possible. We don’t have everything but we have want we need. Fairy tales all they want is money, to be happy, have a handsome prince charming, and rich. Now people don’t even know what they want, they don’t know what an ideal hero would be for them. Now all they care about is beauty and money. Fairy tales have played a big role in that mostly with younger kids, when they watch the movies from Disney they want to have that perfect life and marry a prince charming.
Maria G.
In older fairy tales the character is usually trapped in the moral of the story and doesn't always get a hero. Some heroes that I can think of are the huntsman in little red riding hood,Gretel saves Hansel from getting eatten, Cinderella's fairy god mother. To me the term hero refers to someone who saves someone from a situation or has been there for someone in a time of need. Glorified by secret identies and caps I believe heroes come into stories when the main charcter must be their own hero or when someone just happens to sneak into the story. All modern day stories teach of the prince saving the princess but as real life has taught ladies (and the earlier fairy tales understood) was that many times you are your own savior. Being with someone usually means finding common ground and being able to stand that person for longer than a day. Many tales now leave the notion that everything should end good for the characters and the man should save the woman because he is the strong and brave one. She is always the moral of the story. Did they not ever think of Zenia the warrior princess when it comes to fairy tales. The warrior princess could have come in on her horse and swooped up princey. Society has reared us differently though. Why is it though that earlier tales reflect men as bad people in fairy tales or bystanders? Is this a reflection of our place in family structures often or a common way of expressing characters? Honestly I think many people associate people with powers that help a character because realistically more normal people would just watch something happen instead of doing something about it.
My ideal hero would be intelligent, funny, respectful, and compassionate. He would also have a sense of fun and adventure. I think these are all admirable qualities in a man, but also people in general. I would like to think that I possess most of these qualities myself, some more than others of course. It would be a nice change if the men in fairy tales possessed these qualities. I do think the males of fairy tales are kind of assigned the role of villain or hero, and with those roles comes certain typical character traits.
I noticed in fairy tales that the men are usually portrayed as either a villainous trickster trying to lure the woman into danger somehow or the cookie cutter Prince Charming figure that was mentioned in this post. Usually we don't know too much about this supposed "hero" either, except that he has come to rescue his princess or the female character from her life, or help her fulfill her duty of marrying. He is usually rich and good looking, but besides that seems to lack personality or at least it is not extensively described. This is a shame because I know for most women, myself included, looks and money are not near enough. Besides that, what makes him a worthy hero? I guess coming to the rescue of the damsel in distress, but he is getting a beautiful bride or potential bride in return. That is why I doubt his rescue is really selfless. Would he rescue the woman if she was ugly? I don't think so, but then again the female characters of fairy tales are always beautiful.
I just think the men of fairy tales are a little underdeveloped most of the time as far as the story line goes. We don't really know much about them. Male characters with character, in fact with any type of personality, are really lacking in fairy tales.
Ashley S.
It does seem that in fairytales that the men are tricksters. But I think it has to be this way. Otherwise the story would be boring. The man cannot just come in and save the girl or make something bad not happen because then there would be no story. So the fact that the man is the way he is in fairytales makes the story. Because of they were how they should be, nice, heroic, loyal, ect. Then there would be no story. If the dad wouldn’t have died in the stories or left for war then the father would have protected her daughter and the evil step mom would have not been able to try to destroy her. That does not make a very interesting story if you ask me. The male character is known for being the protection. So if he were there, doing what he should be doing and is known to do,. Then there would be no story, not a good one anyway.
Amanda F.
What are the qualities of a hero? Where does the hero stand in our life? Why is a hero important in our society? What kind of actions does a hero take? A hero is someone who fights for a cause; someone who doesn’t think twice about risking their lives! A hero is an individual who can be looked up for their actions. Most importantly of all, a true hero makes a significance by giving us the feeling of security and knowing we have somebody who is there to help others. Also a hero gives people the strength to continue life’s difficulties in their everyday lives.
My ideal hero for my child would be someone that is caring, respectful, and educated. But most important of all, a hero that would make my child happy unlike many of the fairy tales where the perfect guy disappears, in which leads many woman to suffer. For example, Snow White,” and “Hansel and Gretel” demonstrate the father’s lack of appearance affects the family dynamics and the children’s cognitive growth. I come to realize that in the original fairy tales and Disney’s version fairy tales depict a hero as handsome, rich, wealthy, and strong. But in many cases, appearances are deceiving because as shown in the fairy tales the heroes disappear and grow selfish. I come to conclude the many of these women in the stories are only interested in their statues, beauty, and money. With this in mind, women have lost the touch of love in their lives and therefore have grown sinful to their surroundings. Because fairy tales portray a hero as prince charming many children today struggle with the fact, that this is unrealistic goals in finding a person with these perfect qualities. Woman, nowadays, are battling in finding that perfect man/person which really doesn’t exist. As a result, Disney’s version has effected many women’s expectations of a man and finding true love. I believe every woman would like a hero that would be there through good times and bad times.
~Mary Cruz A.
I really have thought about this issue a lot with the prince/male roles in fairy tales. What are they supposed to be? Or what role are they really supposed to fulfill? It seems to vary in all different fairy tales, but the only fairy tales that I can think of off the top of my head, the male figure is either the prince who saves the day or the father that is just mentioned but never there. In fairy tales that we have recently read in class like Snow White and Cinderella, their fathers are not there at all, yet they seem to be taking care of themselves just fine even with their “evil” stepmothers trying to destroy them and their lives. The princes’ in these fairy tales are very stereotypical and “cookie cutter Prince Charming’s.” In today’s society what guy is really going to come along, save you from your family issues, or whatever other problems you have and is just going to take you away? It’s like these fairytales are all based on love at first sight stories, which I don’t really believe in myself.
Today, my idea of a Prince would be a gentleman who is caring, respectful, trustworthy, and is a great friend to you as well. There are a lot of guys out there lately that I have met that are so disrespectful and rude to girls. They make comments that are unreal and you think to yourself “what would their mother think is they heard their son talking like this?” I would really love to meet an old fashion guy who would pick me up at my place for our date, bring me flowers, take me to dinner and then out somewhere. A guy who will open the door for me and pull out my chair at dinner too! These guys either don’t seem to really exist anymore, or I’m looking at the wrong types of guys in the wrong places. My mother always told me though, “When you go out to the bars have fun and be social, but always know that you will never find your husband at a bar.”
-k*K
The ideal man for me would be a great Christian man. One who lives his life for the Lord and has much of the same viewpoints as me. A man who makes me laugh when I am down. Preferable he will love sports and love to be active. He would have to be an honest man and be able to show me his feelings. I do not think that it is right for people to say that men should not cry. I think it shows a true man when he isn’t afraid to show the woman he loves what he is feeling, what is upsetting him. Although the “fairy tale” men all seem perfect, the perfect guy for me would be able to admit his faults and admit when he is wrong. I would want him to support me in all that I do. Encourage me and push me to be better than I think I can be. This is the type of man that I want and I think my whole family would agree. For my daughter I would want the same and more. I believe I have found this man and although he is not perfect, he is perfect for me. He is very supportive and I think our life will be very good. We are both realistic though and know that it won’t be a fairy tale. It will be very hard at times but if we work together we will make it through anything.
The perfect man, or "prince charming," does not exist. He will not ever exist. He's a poorly portrayed male in fairy tales designed to make young girls grow up believing the pathetic princes from the stories are who they should be on the look out for, and that they should not settle for anything less than this, "prince charming guy." I've been with my fiance for five years now. We were high school sweethearts, and then he joined the Marine Corps. He's brave, smart, funny, sweet, reliable, loving, thoughtful, gorgeous, if I do say so myself :), noble, charming, energetic, honest, exciting, fun-loving, cleanly, and my hero. But he is not perfect. He is absolutely nowhere near perfect. He's got flaws, and so does every other guy in the world. You don't love somebody because you think they're just perfect and can do no wrong, you love them in spite of their flaws, and sometimes, even for them. Prince Charming isn't out there, you're more likely to just find a loser in aluminum foil rather than your knight in shining armor.
C.S
This is a really good question that can be hard to answer but interesting to think about. Although I don’t have any kids yet I do have two sisters, and from the male perspective I have thought about this since I fear having only daughters as I would be scared for them to get hurt by love just like I fear for my sisters to get hurt. This question though would be a great thing if parents would be able to choose the perfect ideal hero for their daughter/s, I imagine. Being in the situation that I am in I can state that first of all the ideal hero would have to know very well what respect is. A guy who is respectful has automatically earned a point with the heroine’s family. In my opinion there is nothing more unpleasant in the eyes of a family than to see that the guy that wants to date a loved one is total joke that knows nothing about respect and manners. Other things that the ideal hero for a loved one (whether daughters or sisters) would need to have are emotional stability, appreciation for the loved one, knowledgeable, ability to make good choices, and the ability to care and provide for her. Although those things don’t cover it all, I believe they are essential things that the guy that will take care of a loved one needs to have. Something to keep in mind though is, (and although I don’t have any kids I have heard parents say this before) that there will never be the PERFECT guy in the eyes of parents that will be good enough for their daughter/s. They may approach that perfect bar, but will never completely reach it. Jose Magallon,
Fairy tales often portray the man of the household or the male protagonist as a bumbling idiot who prances his way through life without taking on the tasks of a quality male role model. The ideal man would be one grounded in moral fortitude. Integrity would be the keyword that defines his acitons. Gentle and loving would guide the manner in which he treats women. Chivalrous and kind, the ideal man would be an example to the younger men and boys to look to find meaning in the role of men. With a mind of practicality and a firm grasp of his wallet, the ideal hero is a man that does not permit himself to become a slave to debt, but invests the family money in items of true value. Frivolous and spontaneous purchases would not be an issue in his family, for this man values the notion that his children are watching his example at all times. The Ideal Hero would stand for what is right, never kneeling to corruption or to popular belief.
Brian N.
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